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| GUY |
 Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 12:22 pm Post subject: Upon Death |
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Forum Freshman
Joined: 09 Jul 2008
Posts: 19
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I am about to die, my physical state has been rapidly declining for the last six months. I sense that I am close to my final days in a hospital bed. Much of my family has come because they can not deny the inevitable, I will pass. There is much talk of heaven, god bless, and a watch over us or two. Me being me, I think about how much focus everyone has put on a creator in my final days. I’m thinking most people probably accept god or Jesus on their death beds. Yet I can’t help myself looking at things in a logical fashion. I am not scared, I will die like the rest of you, but I do not say I believe just in case! I know that men have written this bible and there are men who have written a lot of books such as Green Eggs and Ham and If I Did It. I do not go to an institution dedicated to worship of these books, why would I for any other book? Men are the soul creators of script. The people that pronounce their belief of thy holy on their death beds are the same as those criminals who rat another criminal out to get a lesser sentence. These people lack a back bone. How can I be so delusional, even so close to death, that a planet, a sun, the solar system, this galaxy, and the infinite amount of other planets/suns/solar-systems/galaxies were created for man! How can my thoughts be so selfish and arrogant! The act of an all powerful being creating man and this world is like a child finding spiders and insects putting them in a jar and shaking it. I would not pray to this cruel entity or want spend an eternity in its heaven! I am not afraid to say I do not know, but I will not say I do when I can not.
(I am not dying, I just felt like writing in this style) |
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| Hanuka |
| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 2:19 pm Post subject: |
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Forum Ph.D.
Joined: 18 Apr 2008
Posts: 640
Location: The 10th Kingdom xD
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I agree with your points.
I see those who go crying to God or Jesus when they are in trouble(wheras not
being religious before) are a bunch of wussies that dunno what to do so they
make a run of the mill prayer to God so he won't send them to hell or something
like this.
_________________
Good Brother
~~~~~~~~~~
Science is what we do when we don't know what we're doing.. ROFL xD
Feed Meeee! |
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| 425 Chaotic Requisition |
| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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The Doctor
Joined: 18 Jun 2007
Posts: 3331
Location: England, UK.
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They're just looking for someone to lean on. We all need that now and again. Except one.
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"Victory is in trying. Defeat is in not". - SVRDW. |
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| Pong |
| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 3:22 pm Post subject: |
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Forum Professor
Joined: 08 Apr 2008
Posts: 1412
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I'm pretty sure I would break under torture. Sign confessions, pose naked for photos or whatever. I reserve the right to blubber like a three-year-old on my deathbed.
I believe that one's convictions are stronger, in a way, stripped of idealism. There is truth; and then there is me, far from it. |
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| Theoryofrelativity |
| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 3:41 pm Post subject: Re: Upon Death |
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Forum Professor
Joined: 24 Jul 2006
Posts: 1166
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| GUY wrote: |
(I am not dying, I just felt like writing in this style) |
I actually knew this from reading the first line.
People faced with death have a somewhat different experience to that which you describe and it may or may not involve God.
Here is a sample of what goes through ones mind.
http://searchwarp.com/swa235345.htm
_________________
'Time is the space between birth and death' by me. |
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| punarmusiko |
| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 5:34 pm Post subject: Re: Upon Death |
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Forum Junior
Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 210
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| Theoryofrelativity wrote: |
| GUY wrote: |
(I am not dying, I just felt like writing in this style) |
I actually knew this from reading the first line.
People faced with death have a somewhat different experience to that which you describe and it may or may not involve God.
Here is a sample of what goes through ones mind.
http://searchwarp.com/swa235345.htm |
sure
death takes one to one's roots and not this sort of high fluting stuff |
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| mitchellmckain |
| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 7:09 pm Post subject: Re: Upon Death |
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Forum Professor
Joined: 06 Oct 2005
Posts: 1987
Location: Salt Lake City, UTAH, USA
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| Theoryofrelativity wrote: |
| GUY wrote: |
(I am not dying, I just felt like writing in this style) |
I actually knew this from reading the first line.
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I had a somewhat different reaction to the first few lines.
| GUY wrote: |
| I am about to die, my physical state has been rapidly declining for the last six months. I sense that I am close to my final days in a hospital bed. Much of my family has come because they can not deny the inevitable, I will pass. |
Ahh... sounds like someone waking up from a dream. That you were going to die was of course inevitable the moment you were born. I think it is pretty ridiculous that people pretend that they are not going to die through most of their life. But I suppose we see the same behavior in people approaching the day of a test where they simply do not think about it until last moment.
As for me I am constantly aware of it, so for me nothing really changes on my death bed, assuming my mind is still functioning, except a little less uncertainty about when.
| GUY wrote: |
Me being me, I think about how much focus everyone has put on a creator in my final days. I’m thinking most people probably accept god or Jesus on their death beds. Yet I can’t help myself looking at things in a logical fashion. I am not scared, I will die like the rest of you, but I do not say I believe just in case! I know that men have written this bible and there are men who have written a lot of books such as Green Eggs and Ham and If I Did It. I do not go to an institution dedicated to worship of these books, why would I for any other book? Men are the soul creators of script. The people that pronounce their belief of thy holy on their death beds are the same as those criminals who rat another criminal out to get a lesser sentence. These people lack a back bone. How can I be so delusional, even so close to death, that a planet, a sun, the solar system, this galaxy, and the infinite amount of other planets/suns/solar-systems/galaxies were created for man! How can my thoughts be so selfish and arrogant! The act of an all powerful being creating man and this world is like a child finding spiders and insects putting them in a jar and shaking it. I would not pray to this cruel entity or want spend an eternity in its heaven! I am not afraid to say I do not know, but I will not say I do when I can not.
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I absolutely agree, and I find it astounding that Christians actually think, that this sort of intellectual blackmail that threatens eternal hell, can possibly work --- EXCEPT perhaps that it has already worked on them. Such cowardice! No I shall flip off this ridiculous excuse for a god and follow the example of mythical Sissyphus with contented heart, welcoming the repudiation and tortue of such a god as affirmation of my own integrity.
Of course no such god and the peace of oblivion is far preferable to that. But such a welcome peace and sweet escape that the darkeness of oblivion offers seems to me just a little too good to be true. No the stuff of my nightmares is neither the torture of an angry god or the impotent threat of non-existence, but something quite different that flows from the awakening awareness of darkness within myself. Instead I imagine a place where dreams come true -- where the secret desires of the heart are as easy to grasp as moving your little finger. This is the place that I imagine with terror, for I have a little too much knowledge of myself to think that such a place can mean anything good for me, for I do not imagine that I am immune to corruption.
So while I can congratulate the atheist for overcoming the first fear and thus repudiating the cruel god and the other ridiculous things that so many Christians seem to believe in. I must look upon the belief of the atheist in sweet oblivion as the same kind of wishful thinking that they imagine that the usual Christian is induging in with his childish and sterile image of heaven. The truth is that the motivations that Guy imagines that people have for believing in God and an afterlife, have absolutely NOTHING to do with the God that I believe in and NOTHING to do with the Christianity that I believe in. All the reasons that Guy gives are used by me as well as my final answer to a Christian who insists on the truth of His soul destroying, suicide torturing, self-glorifying, ego-maniacal, racist control freak god, where I will simply explain to him that his weird intepretations remove every single reason that I could have for believing in the Bible or in Chrisitanity.
| Pong wrote: |
I'm pretty sure I would break under torture. Sign confessions, pose naked for photos or whatever. I reserve the right to blubber like a three-year-old on my deathbed.
I believe that one's convictions are stronger, in a way, stripped of idealism. There is truth; and then there is me, far from it.
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Hmmm... Yes such an exploration of truth about self sounds pretty exciting. No I don't think I would volunteer, but the prospect of seeing realized a lifetime's effort to strip away the illusions and face the bone of truth, is still a thrilling one.
I know I cannot control my physical reactions and I also know that life offers no guarantees that our rationality will endure, for a great many of us will have this stripped from us one way or another before the end. So all I can say is that if my rationality is intact, I will most certainly not believe the lie of a torturer that what he does depends on what I do. I will not give him what he wants - not by choice - not if there is any rationality left in me. Doing what is right to do, to the best of my ability is the only thing that makes any sense, and his threats, no different from the threats of a torturer god, are irrelevant.
_________________
See my physics of spaceflight simulator at http://www.relspace.astahost.com
Last edited by mitchellmckain on Fri Jul 11, 2008 1:12 am; edited 2 times in total |
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| GUY |
| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 9:09 pm Post subject: Re: Upon Death |
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Forum Freshman
Joined: 09 Jul 2008
Posts: 19
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| Quote: |
People faced with death have a somewhat different experience to that which you describe and it may or may not involve God.
Here is a sample of what goes through ones mind.
http://searchwarp.com/swa235345.htm |
[/quote]
I do not fear dying because I do not enjoy life, I simply understand the irony of existing. The second I was brought into the world was the second I was sentenced to death. I suppose you could get all technical and say it was when I won “the race”, the one where I swam through my mom’s lady parts and burrowed into the largest egg I had ever seen at that point in time. Wow. I enjoy my life and have not even begun to achieve all my goals or plans. If for some reason I was to die or had a sure death sentence then as simple as i can put it, that’s life! |
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| Theoryofrelativity |
| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 12:01 am Post subject: Re: Upon Death |
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Forum Professor
Joined: 24 Jul 2006
Posts: 1166
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I do not fear dying because I do not enjoy life, [/quote]
Yet you continue to feed yourself? You still 'fight' to remain alive.
I know how you feel though, been there. Maybe you too will get a wake up call that will change your thinking in this regard.
If you don't like life, change it.
_________________
'Time is the space between birth and death' by me. |
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| mitchellmckain |
| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 12:10 am Post subject: Re: Upon Death |
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Forum Professor
Joined: 06 Oct 2005
Posts: 1987
Location: Salt Lake City, UTAH, USA
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| Theoryofrelativity wrote: |
| GUY wrote: |
I do not fear dying because I do not enjoy life, |
Yet you continue to feed yourself? You still 'fight' to remain alive.
I know how you feel though, been there. Maybe you too will get a wake up call that will change your thinking in this regard.
If you don't like life, change it. |
I am pretty sure that what GUY meant to say was:
"The reason I do not fear dying is not because I do not enjoy life, but simply because I understand the irony of existing."
This is what fits best with the context of the rest of his paragraph.
_________________
See my physics of spaceflight simulator at http://www.relspace.astahost.com |
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| GUY |
| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 12:38 am Post subject: Re: Upon Death |
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Forum Freshman
Joined: 09 Jul 2008
Posts: 19
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[quote]
| Quote: |
[quote="mitchellmckain"]
I am pretty sure that what GUY meant to say was:
"The reason I do not fear dying is not because I do not enjoy life, but simply because I understand the irony of existing." |
I couldn't have said it any better myself, in fact, as you know I tried!
It's like you're my spine because you got my back. I just made that up, so I'm a bit pleased with my self right now. |
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| Theoryofrelativity |
| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 6:58 am Post subject: Re: Upon Death |
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Forum Professor
Joined: 24 Jul 2006
Posts: 1166
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[quote="GUY"]
| Quote: |
| Quote: |
[quote="mitchellmckain"]
I am pretty sure that what GUY meant to say was:
"The reason I do not fear dying is not because I do not enjoy life, but simply because I understand the irony of existing." |
I couldn't have said it any better myself, in fact, as you know I tried!
It's like you're my spine because you got my back. I just made that up, so I'm a bit pleased with my self right now. |
well I read it exactly like you wrote it. Glad you enjoy your life.
May I now suggest you find something better to do with it than moaning about how dying peoples belief system sometimes changes.
You have no idea what you will do until faced with a challenge. I find people who think they can anticipate how they will react/not react in all unseen events are those who rarely have an unseen event, in other words their lives are entirely eventless.
Woopie doo
_________________
'Time is the space between birth and death' by me. |
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| mitchellmckain |
| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 2:55 pm Post subject: Re: Upon Death |
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Forum Professor
Joined: 06 Oct 2005
Posts: 1987
Location: Salt Lake City, UTAH, USA
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| Theoryofrelativity wrote: |
You have no idea what you will do until faced with a challenge. I find people who think they can anticipate how they will react/not react in all unseen events are those who rarely have an unseen event, in other words their lives are entirely eventless.
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On the contrary. I think you are quite wrong. There are those who react to events with shock and paralysis and those who react by taking charge and acting and I think the difference is precisely that some people DON'T think about how they will react and never imagine what they will do in such circumstances while other people are always thinking about these things and planning what they will do so that when these things happen, they don't even need to think about it.
Frankly, it is the difference between waking and sleeping through life.
_________________
See my physics of spaceflight simulator at http://www.relspace.astahost.com |
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| GUY |
| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 7:57 pm Post subject: Re: Upon Death |
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Forum Freshman
Joined: 09 Jul 2008
Posts: 19
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| Quote: |
[quote="mitchellmckain"]
| Theoryofrelativity wrote: |
You have no idea what you will do until faced with a challenge. I find people who think they can anticipate how they will react/not react in all unseen events are those who rarely have an unseen event, in other words their lives are entirely eventless.
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On the contrary. I think you are quite wrong. There are those who react to events with shock and paralysis and those who react by taking charge and acting and I think the difference is precisely that some people DON'T think about how they will react and never imagine what they will do in such circumstances while other people are always thinking about these things and planning what they will do so that when these things happen, they don't even need to think about it. |
I can assure you that my life is not all that mundane. I am an extremely physical and active person. I currently enjoy bodysurfing, surfing, spear fishing, soccer, basketball, rugby, wiffleball, skating, biking, Frisbee golf…I could keep going, but if that doesn’t do it then I can’t help you. I have never had a severe sickness or disease, but I have done plenty of stupid things to end up in a life threatening situation. I know what I did then and what I thought about! I survived and I thought about surviving!
Mitchellmckain…hey, keep hitting those nails on the head!
Almost forgot…you know how people always say if I had a nickel for every time…blah blah blah…well j-walking would make me rich! I’m a pro!
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| Pong |
| Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 12:13 am Post subject: Re: Upon Death |
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Forum Professor
Joined: 08 Apr 2008
Posts: 1412
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| mitchellmckain wrote: |
| the difference is precisely that some people DON'T think about how they will react and never imagine what they will do in such circumstances while other people are always thinking about these things and planning what they will do so that when these things happen, they don't even need to think about it. |
Would you like
green eggs and ham?
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I do not like them,
Sam-I-am.
I do not like
green eggs and ham. |
Would you like them
here or there?
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I would not like them
here or there.
I would not like them
anywhere.
I do not like
green eggs and ham.
I do not like them,
Sam-I-am. |
You do not like them.
So you say.
Try them! Try them!
And you may.
Try them and you may, I say. |
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