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| humanhuman |
 Posted: Sat May 31, 2008 7:24 am Post subject: The YUXI Problem. |
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Forum Freshman
Joined: 15 Nov 2007
Posts: 17
Location: London
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The YUXI Problem.
Suppose there’s a being, (i) belonging to a species, (u) headed for extinction because (u) believes in, and acts on the basis of x, rather than y.
(i) knows x to be the cause of the impending demise of (u). (i) knows y to be more valid than x. (i) believes that acting in accord with y would allow (u) to continue to exist.
(i) has tried to make (u) understand y – but to no avail.
What should (i) do? |
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| Selene |
| Posted: Sat May 31, 2008 8:18 am Post subject: |
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Banned
Joined: 04 Feb 2008
Posts: 1060
Location: I live in Bertrand Russells teapot!
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[Shrugs shoulders]
Who cares?
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| free radical |
| Posted: Sat May 31, 2008 8:46 am Post subject: Re: The YUXI Problem. |
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Forum Masters Degree
Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 503
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| humanhuman wrote: |
The YUXI Problem.
Suppose there’s a being, (i) belonging to a species, (u) headed for extinction because (u) believes in, and acts on the basis of x, rather than y.
(i) knows x to be the cause of the impending demise of (u). (i) knows y to be more valid than x. (i) believes that acting in accord with y would allow (u) to continue to exist.
(i) has tried to make (u) understand y – but to no avail.
What should (i) do? |
Why is (i) interested in saving species (u)? And, how does (i) know the behaviour of (u) is what is leading to extinction? And finally, how can (i) be certain that extinction, rather than serious population decline w/out extinction, will be the outcome of believing (x)? |
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| Hanuka |
| Posted: Sat May 31, 2008 9:21 am Post subject: |
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Forum Masters Degree
Joined: 18 Apr 2008
Posts: 578
Location: The 10th Kingdom xD
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I think this can be templated on the Jews in WW1/2.
Where christians that didnt want to see them die tried to change their
beliefs so they wont die by nazis hand...
Ya can't just change someones belief that easely after (u) possibly belived
in x for many years, even if its to save (u)`s butt.
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| free radical |
| Posted: Sat May 31, 2008 9:39 am Post subject: |
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Forum Masters Degree
Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 503
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So not to prevent extinction, but to save some number of individuals.
One could successfully argue that (i) did change (u)'s behaviour and beliefs wrt the jews. |
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| 425 Chaotic Requisition |
| Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 3:46 am Post subject: Re: The YUXI Problem. |
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The Doctor
Joined: 18 Jun 2007
Posts: 3207
Location: Somewhere, nowhere.
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| humanhuman wrote: |
The YUXI Problem.
Suppose there’s a being, (i) belonging to a species, (u) headed for extinction because (u) believes in, and acts on the basis of x, rather than y.
(i) knows x to be the cause of the impending demise of (u). (i) knows y to be more valid than x. (i) believes that acting in accord with y would allow (u) to continue to exist.
(i) has tried to make (u) understand y – but to no avail.
What should (i) do? |
Run.
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"Laugh at life or it will laugh at you". - SVRDW. |
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| Cold Fusion |
| Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 3:59 pm Post subject: |
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Forum Ph.D.
Joined: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 758
Location: In the circuitous haze of my mind
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Hey! Your back!
Well, myself believing Y (same as you), all we can do is hope for the best. I have decided that it is impossible to change beliefs such as X; the second X is contemplated in a single entities mind, X spreads like a virus until it infects all but those who are intellectually immune to it. Because of this, you cannot remedy the problem, ever, and even if a large portion of the entities containing X die off, it will re-spread very quickly, and potentially surpass its previous number of victims.
I feel all civilizations are like Sisyphus, going so far, only to inevitably have all that is gained through so much work return to nothing almost instantly.
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Forget all that you know, achievements can only be accomplished by starting from nothing and selectively applying facts that are purely objective and absolutely necessary.
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"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence"
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Use your computing strength for science! |
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| humanhuman |
| Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 4:28 am Post subject: |
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Forum Freshman
Joined: 15 Nov 2007
Posts: 17
Location: London
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The yuxi problem.
One might think that if y were a reasonable solution to the problems caused by x – (i) would be listened to, or (u) would arrive at these conclusions some other way. However, x is a rationale unto itself, rather than a rationale unto reality, and this undermines (u)’s ability to order real world priorities. Circumstance and disposition have allowed (i) to see beyond the rationale of x – while the majority remain tied into this rationale by the ongoing negotiation of social, political and economic activities in these terms.
That the impending extinction of the species is not held to be a non-contingent priority demonstrates the psychosis induced by belief in x, and this constitutes the problem. The psychosis lies in the apparent justification of x by action and thought in terms of x, whereas (i) has been able to view x from the outside and see that while internally coherent, x externalizes large parts of reality. These externalized realities, mounting for generations, now threaten the very existence of the species. However, (u) is unable to recognize these threats, less yet address them, for they lie outside the conceptual framework of x. |
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| Cold Fusion |
| Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 11:58 pm Post subject: |
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Forum Ph.D.
Joined: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 758
Location: In the circuitous haze of my mind
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Exactly.
_________________
Forget all that you know, achievements can only be accomplished by starting from nothing and selectively applying facts that are purely objective and absolutely necessary.
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."
"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence"
-Einstein
http://boinc.berkeley.edu/download.php
Use your computing strength for science! |
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| Pong |
| Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 2:02 am Post subject: |
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Forum Professor
Joined: 08 Apr 2008
Posts: 1248
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Suppose (u) believes that while (x) reality is futile, (y) reality is entropic, and recognises that (u), itself comprising reality, validates whatever reality it wills. A fully informed (u) prefers to inflict (x) - "a rationale unto itself, rather than a rationale unto reality" - for reality's greater enrichment.
Suppose (i) is a pawn of (y), adding nothing. |
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| humanhuman |
| Posted: Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:34 am Post subject: |
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Forum Freshman
Joined: 15 Nov 2007
Posts: 17
Location: London
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Pong,
An informed (u) would be correct to beleive that y is ultimately entropic, but not on any timescale significant to the purposes of (u). x on the other hand poses a clear and present danger (u) employs x to deny.
(i) would be honoured to be considered a pawn of y, would worship y in every word thought and deed in obedience to the profound and truthfull meaning that flows from y like a cool mountain stream on a hot summers day, as opposed to squatting in the rain by the fetid sewer that is x. |
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