| Author |
Message
|
| coberst |
 Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 3:04 am Post subject: Teachers: Double Their Salary and Quantity |
 |
|
Forum Bachelors Degree
Joined: 18 Feb 2007
Posts: 433
|
Teachers: Double Their Salary and Quantity
Few things are more important to our national longevity, wellbeing, and security than well educated citizens. Nothing of such importance is so misunderstood and ignored in America.
I suspect that this important matter lacks sophisticated understanding by Americans because adult Americans had a poor education.
I claim that our education policy results from the intentionality of those who strongly affect public policy rather than misunderstanding by the citizens. I claim that the power of Corporate America greatly determines our public policy and thus our educational system, which is designed to graduate good producers and consumers.
I think that adult Americans must resist the temptation to store their critical intellect with their year-book in the attic when their school daze are over.
To lend support for my claim I have copied this paragraph from an article “Don’t Blame All Borrowers” from the Washington Post http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/04/25/AR2008042502783.html
“Yet millions of families got into financial trouble simply because they understood that life is graded on the curve. The best jobs go to graduates from the best colleges, and because only the best-prepared students are accepted to those colleges, it is quixotic to expect parents to bypass an opportunity to send their children to the best elementary and secondary schools they can. The financial deregulation that enabled them to bid ever larger amounts for houses in the best school districts essentially guaranteed a housing bubble that would leave millions of families dangerously overextended.” |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
| Theoryofrelativity |
| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 3:30 am Post subject: Re: Teachers: Double Their Salary and Quantity |
|
|
Forum Professor
Joined: 24 Jul 2006
Posts: 1166
|
| coberst wrote: |
I think that adult Americans must resist the temptation to store their critical intellect with their year-book in the attic when their school daze are over.
|
Indeed education is poor
Meanwhile
It suits the governments of the world to have a large underclass, because uneducated people do not ask questions, they do not protest, they are mostly compliant and easily manipulated. In other words they do as they are told by the state and believe what they are led to believe.
Sheep serve a purpose without needing to be intellectual, only the sheep dogs and their handlers are required to have brains in order to control them.
_________________
'Time is the space between birth and death' by me. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| coberst |
| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 10:53 am Post subject: |
|
|
Forum Bachelors Degree
Joined: 18 Feb 2007
Posts: 433
|
| If we make teaching the most sought after profession in America we would be taking a giant step for mankind. Fifty years ago we could find good teachers for low pay because women had no were else to turn. But today they have options. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Theoryofrelativity |
| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 11:29 am Post subject: |
|
|
Forum Professor
Joined: 24 Jul 2006
Posts: 1166
|
| coberst wrote: |
| But today they have options. |
You make that sound like a bad thing
Like I said, the powers that be don't WANT good teachers.
_________________
'Time is the space between birth and death' by me. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Harold14370 |
| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 11:44 am Post subject: |
|
|
Forum Professor
Joined: 13 Apr 2007
Posts: 1675
Location: Pennsylvania
|
I think that's a load of crap, Coberst. People do try to move to good school districts but there is and was nothing whatsoever to prevent them from buying or building a modest home. But people bought the big houses because they got tax breaks because they could write off the interest, and they thought they were making a good investment.
I don't think this guy is a real economist. He's just a socialist like you.
Why all this conspiracy nonsense? We live in a democracy. We ARE the powers that be. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| i_feel_tiredsleepy |
| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 12:46 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Forum Ph.D.
Joined: 21 Mar 2008
Posts: 659
Location: Montreal
|
Teachers do receive low pay for University educated individuals, but so do nurses. That's the underside of being a profession employed by the government. If every teacher was making 60-80K a year the public school system would collapse.
Something people don't take into consideration is that although teachers are not payed well, they do get 2-3 month vacations every year, and they have job security. No matter how bad the economy gets, the schools will stay open and the teachers will keep getting their cheques. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| coberst |
| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 11:34 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Forum Bachelors Degree
Joined: 18 Feb 2007
Posts: 433
|
| Harold14370 wrote: |
I think that's a load of crap, Coberst. People do try to move to good school districts but there is and was nothing whatsoever to prevent them from buying or building a modest home. But people bought the big houses because they got tax breaks because they could write off the interest, and they thought they were making a good investment.
I don't think this guy is a real economist. He's just a socialist like you.
Why all this conspiracy nonsense? We live in a democracy. We ARE the powers that be. |
CA (Corporate America) has developed a well-honed expertise in motivating the population to behave in a desired manner. Citizens as consumers are ample manifestation of that expertise. CA has accomplished this ability by careful study and implementation of the knowledge of the ways of human behavior. I suspect this same structure applies to most Western democracies.
A democratic form of government is one wherein the citizens have some voice in some policy decisions. The greater the voice of the citizens the better the democracy.
In America we have policy makers, decision makers, and citizens. The decision makers are our elected representatives and are, thus, under some control by the voting citizen. The policy makers are the leaders of CA; less than ten thousand individuals, according to those who study such matters. Policy makers exercise significant control of decision makers by controlling the financing of elections.
Policy makers customize and maintain the dominant ideology in order to control the political behavior of the citizens. This dominant ideology exercises the political control of the citizens in the same fashion as the consuming citizen is controlled by the same dominant ideology.
An enlightened citizen is the only means to gain more voice in more policy decisions. An enlightened citizen is much more than an informed citizen. Critical thinking is the only practical means to develop a more enlightened citizen. If, however, we wait until our CT trained grade-schoolers become adults I suspect all will be lost. This is why I think a massive effort must be made to convince today’s adults that they must train themselves in CT.
“Thomas R. Dye, Professor of Political Science at Florida State University, has published a series of books examining who and what institutions actually control and run America. to understand who is making the decisions that affect our lives, we also have to understand how societies structure themselves in general. Why the few always tend to share more power than the many and what this means in terms of both a society's evolution and our daily lives. they examined the other 11 institutions that exert just as powerful a shaping influence, although somewhat more subtle: The Industrial, Corporations, Utilities and Communications, Banking, Insurance Investment, Mass Media, Law, Education Foundation, Civic and Cultural Organizations, Government, and the Military.”
http://www.21stcenturyradio.com/12-dye.html |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Theoryofrelativity |
| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 11:52 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Forum Professor
Joined: 24 Jul 2006
Posts: 1166
|
| Harold14370 wrote: |
Why all this conspiracy nonsense? We live in a democracy. We ARE the powers that be. |
Haha
How naive are you?
_________________
'Time is the space between birth and death' by me. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Theoryofrelativity |
| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 11:57 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Forum Professor
Joined: 24 Jul 2006
Posts: 1166
|
| coberst wrote: |
An enlightened citizen is the only means to gain more voice in more policy decisions. An enlightened citizen is much more than an informed citizen. Critical thinking is the only practical means to develop a more enlightened citizen. If, however, we wait until our CT trained grade-schoolers become adults I suspect all will be lost. This is why I think a massive effort must be made to convince today’s adults that they must train themselves in CT.
|
Well said
Even the US justice system is 'corrupt' they employ people readers to select a jury that will vote a given way. Read 'Reading people' by Jo-Ellan Dimitrius. She helped select the jury that aquitted OJ Simpson. It was her job to read the jury, judges and evaluate witnesses.
_________________
'Time is the space between birth and death' by me. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Pong |
| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 1:30 am Post subject: |
|
|
Forum Professor
Joined: 08 Apr 2008
Posts: 1412
|
| Theoryofrelativity wrote: |
| Harold14370 wrote: |
Why all this conspiracy nonsense? We live in a democracy. We ARE the powers that be. |
Haha
How naive are you?
|
I'd call him anti-cynical. But this talk of corporate manipulation and secret agents may boost sales of Che Guevara T-shirts if not PTA activism so it's all good.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Harold14370 |
| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 2:42 am Post subject: |
|
|
Forum Professor
Joined: 13 Apr 2007
Posts: 1675
Location: Pennsylvania
|
| Theoryofrelativity wrote: |
Well said
Even the US justice system is 'corrupt' they employ people readers to select a jury that will vote a given way. Read 'Reading people' by Jo-Ellan Dimitrius. She helped select the jury that aquitted OJ Simpson. It was her job to read the jury, judges and evaluate witnesses. |
When you say it is corrupt, who are you blaming? Which are the powers that be, that want to acquit murdering football players?
| coberst wrote: |
If, however, we wait until our CT trained grade-schoolers become adults I suspect all will be lost. This is why I think a massive effort must be made to convince today’s adults that they must train themselves in CT. |
What exactly are you proposing? You started out talking about the American education system that needs to be fixed, but you didn't say exactly what changes you would make to the curricula. Now all of a sudden, that's no good, it has to be self education. Just exactly how do you think this massive effort is going to happen?
I think you need to work on your own critical thinking skills and put together a coherent argument. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| coberst |
| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 4:12 am Post subject: |
|
|
Forum Bachelors Degree
Joined: 18 Feb 2007
Posts: 433
|
| Harold14370 wrote: |
What exactly are you proposing? You started out talking about the American education system that needs to be fixed, but you didn't say exactly what changes you would make to the curricula. Now all of a sudden, that's no good, it has to be self education. Just exactly how do you think this massive effort is going to happen?
I think you need to work on your own critical thinking skills and put together a coherent argument. |
If we make teaching the most sought after profession in America we would be taking a giant step for mankind. Fifty years ago we could find good teachers for low pay because women had no were else to turn. But today they have options. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| i_feel_tiredsleepy |
| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 8:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
Forum Ph.D.
Joined: 21 Mar 2008
Posts: 659
Location: Montreal
|
Your argument is that the education system is bad because the teachers are bad? This is just absurd, only 1/3 teachers remain teachers after the first 10 years. It is a very high stress job that most people choose for idealistic reasons. I don't believe the best teachers would choose to be teachers for money, the best teachers are the ones that believe in the profession and the mission and do the job despite the shortfalls. It is not the teachers fault the public education system is flawed, it is quite simply funding.
Edit: A lot of fault falls on the parents and the attitudes of todays children as well. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Theoryofrelativity |
| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 11:04 am Post subject: |
|
|
Forum Professor
Joined: 24 Jul 2006
Posts: 1166
|
| i_feel_tiredsleepy wrote: |
It is not the teachers fault the public education system is flawed, it is quite simply funding.
. |
Utter rubbish
There are children in this world in under developed countries with nothing more than a slate and chalk and YET they have a better education than us in the West.
When my kids school asks me for money it really annoys me, as they bleat that they need MORE more more all the time, yet the reality is STUFF is not remotely necessary for a good education. I would rather send my money to those schools that have nothing.
_________________
'Time is the space between birth and death' by me. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| i_feel_tiredsleepy |
| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 11:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
Forum Ph.D.
Joined: 21 Mar 2008
Posts: 659
Location: Montreal
|
| Theoryofrelativity wrote: |
| i_feel_tiredsleepy wrote: |
It is not the teachers fault the public education system is flawed, it is quite simply funding.
. |
Utter rubbish
There are children in this world in under developed countries with nothing more than a slate and chalk and YET they have a better education than us in the West.
When my kids school asks me for money it really annoys me, as they bleat that they need MORE more more all the time, yet the reality is STUFF is not remotely necessary for a good education. I would rather send my money to those schools that have nothing. |
People in underdeveloped countries do not receive better educations than people in the west. The countries which outperform the USA are China, Japan, and most of Europe. Moreover, when I talk about funding I'm not speaking of suburban schools, but inner city schools. My high school didn't have enough text books for every student in the class, and the ones they did have were 20 years old. There is no question that giving teachers more options for teaching improves quality of education. My school didn't have a biology or physics lab, we didn't even have microscopes. Likewise, I've said that the attitude of parents and the students plays a large role, people in the west very often view school as a chore rather than a privilege. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
