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| Purpose of life lost in evolution? |
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| organic god |
 Posted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 9:55 am Post subject: Purpose of life lost in evolution? |
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was walking through london streets today, and was thinking of all the people hurrying to work and all the other things we fill our lives with.
wealth, culture, employment etc.
and i wondered if this was our true purpose in life?
and then i thought of primitive man, where life was simple before all the complications arose and i wondered if we used to live our lives according to the "meaning of life"
i was considering doing some research into this, and maybe finding the real meaning of life.
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| Ophiolite |
| Posted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 10:16 am Post subject: Re: Purpose of life lost in evolution? |
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Forum Radioactive Isotope
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| organic god wrote: |
....and i wondered if this was our true purpose in life?
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Our 'purpose' is to survive and reproduce. Since the emergence of intelligence, consciousness and introspection, we are free to define our own purposes.
| organic god wrote: |
| and then i thought of primitive man, where life was simple before all the complications arose . |
This would be the simplicity of fire making without matches, or piped gas, or electricity. The simplicty of navigation without maps or GPS. The simplicity of animal identification, husbandry and productive use without a university textbook. The simplicity of tool production without a machine shop. The simplicty of knowledge exchange without google. 
| organic god wrote: |
| i was considering doing some research into this, and maybe finding the real meaning of life. |
42. (Just google it.  )
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Last edited by Ophiolite on Tue Jul 15, 2008 12:38 am; edited 1 time in total |
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| Ruro |
| Posted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 7:32 pm Post subject: |
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Wow... I was about to start a similar thread really, similar... I think...
Hey folks btw, I'm usually in the Natural Sciences forum; seldom post but often read 
I'm currently writing a Blog Entry, questioning my existance (just watched a movie called, "Life or Something like that", guess it brought the question up).
I have come to the conclusion, that for as long as I can help some one, by making them feel better Positively, in addition to making myself happy (regardless of mine or their life spans, and how pointless happiness could seem), life is worth living and has a point. Because if... positive spirits in Humans is present... then... it will is likely to lead us to make constructive actions in life, leading to further happiness and we make progress.
The only thing stopping humans, I would GUESS, is Evolution. Before an Asteroid hits us, before we Nuke our planet to bits, before the Sun goes Supernova and envelops our Planet or whatever, we will hopefuly be spread among planets. If the Earth gets f***ed, someone survives somewhere. They could have only teraformed another planet (or made a Mars Base to support Human life, take your pick) - they only achieved that through human progress, by helping each other and individuals working on things they enjoy (double win there, people satisfy there happiness by working on something they like, also leading to other peoples happiness).
So Evolution can stop us? We can avoid natural disasters by advancing in technology and dispersing ourselves more with that, so our "legacy" lives on somewhere... but if the Human Race flaws through "nature", say Genetics somehow are a cause of Humans dying off, then all our hard work is pointless, because no one is left to benefit from anything.
But there are different theories about this, right? Darwins Theory of Evolution, and what not, I don't know anything really on the varied ideas. But... ha... oh dear, there is no definitive answer is there, to how evolution works on such large scales? That prevents us from determining whether our life has meaning or not (working with the cr*p I have presented in this post).
I found myself asking at the last moment in my blog, what are the likely ways Humans can die off? I have already rambled on about Supernova Suns killing us and Genetic Flaws, but I'm not actually well informed in any such area's, so... mystery to me -_-
We must survive, anyway, is all I can say atm.
I guess you have all seen this rant before though, I'm sure it's been spoke of by someone else. Sorry to burst into your thread like that, organic god, I hope this is remotely revelant to your thoughts.
EDIT: To reply to the Threads Title, "Purpose of life lost in evolution?", I would actually ask instead, "Purpose of life lost TO evolution?", will it be our demise. Hmmm, just trying to make sense in my mind: Yours implies meaning of life can be lost while the Human Race lives, where-as mine implies it is never lost unless Evolution destroys us.
And I just realised, there is one other thing to fear besides Evolution. If the theory about the Universe Expanding and Collapsing is true, then... I mean come on, even millenia's down the road, Science couldn't prevent the Universe collapsing >_> Ignorant statement, but it kinda seems safe to say. The Universe Collapsing is the only Natural Disaster that could occur every where at once, I think, to take us all out at once.
And wow, I never managed to account for the third possibility in all my rambling about a lack of, or the opposite of Productivity - how stupid and ignorant of me. Third thing that can kill us is Ourselves, how could I miss something so obvious? XD I even walked right over it when mentioned Nuking our own Planet, oh lawd almighty! Tsk tsk. God bless the edit button, I'm off to bed.
Last edited by Ruro on Mon Jul 14, 2008 8:25 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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| paralith |
| Posted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 8:24 pm Post subject: |
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Ruro, I think you're a little confused - you speak of natural disasters, but these are NOT the same as evolution. Biological evolution = genetic change, and change by itself can be either good or bad depending on exactly what the change is, and the environment in which the change takes place. It is only a process, which should not by itself be feared.
You and organic god might be interested in reading the Purpose thread in the Behavioral and Social Sciences forum.
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Man can will nothing unless he has first understood that he must count on no one but himself; that he is alone, abandoned on earth in the midst of his infinite responsibilities, without help, with no other aim than the one he sets himself, with no other destiny than the one he forges for himself on this earth.
~Jean-Paul Sartre
Monkeys in Clothes - hosted by SFN blogs |
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| Ruro |
| Posted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 8:33 pm Post subject: |
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| paralith wrote: |
| Ruro, I think you're a little confused - you speak of natural disasters, but these are NOT the same as evolution. |
I'll admit, I couldn't give a Definition of Evolution, or explain it really, but I do realise Natural Disasters are not involved. Which part of what I said passed on that idea? Just so I can clarify on what I mean... >_> I was never good at... writing XD lol, why am I here on a forum?! Good question -_-
| paralith wrote: |
| Biological evolution = genetic change, and change by itself can be either good or bad depending on exactly what the change is, and the environment in which the change takes place. It is only a process, which should not by itself be feared. |
Oh yeah, looking at our history we have benefited from change, but surely in the extreme long run of Human Life, can it not go wrong? Unless Biological Evolution has strictly by "some unwritten Law" always worked out - even after some "bad changes" appearing every now and then, the beneficial change that appears to the human race always prevails?
(Edit: Fixed typo) |
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| paralith |
| Posted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 8:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Ruro wrote: |
| I'll admit, I couldn't give a Definition of Evolution, or explain it really, but I do realise Natural Disasters are not involved. Which part of what I said passed on that idea? Just so I can clarify on what I mean... >_> I was never good at... writing XD lol, why am I here on a forum?! Good question -_- |
You said "evolution" is something for humans to fear, and then you mentioned natural disasters and genetic flaws.
| Quote: |
| paralith wrote: |
| Biological evolution = genetic change, and change by itself can be either good or bad depending on exactly what the change is, and the environment in which the change takes place. It is only a process, which should not by itself be feared. |
Oh yeah, looking at our history we have benefited from change, but surely in the extreme long run of Human Life, can it not go wrong? Unless Biological Evolution has strictly by "some unwritten Law" always worked out - even after some "bad changes" appearing every now and then, the beneficial change that appears to the human race always prevails?
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OK, here's a basic explanation of evolution by natural selection.
Evolution is the process of genetic change in a population of individuals. That change can happen in several ways. The only way which can result in adaptations, in traits that increase the reproductive success of the individuals who have them, is the process of natural selection. In this process, some traits are "better" than others. Individuals with the "good" traits pass on more offspring than individuals with the "bad" traits, and over time, the good traits dominate, and the bad traits decrease in frequency and can even be lost completely.
Now, the reason why I put "good" and "bad" in quotation marks is that the fitness value of a trait depends on the environment. For example, thin fur is a good trait in very warm environments, but a bad one in very cold environments. Now let's say that a species of animals with very thin coats are living in a warm environment - but then, an ice age begins. If a few individuals have thicker coats than others, those are the ones that might survive to have viable offspring. Or, if the change happens too fast and too severely, the entire species might die out.
In other words, natural selection always "works out" in that only those individuals that are best suited to the environment can reproduce successfully. But it can "go wrong" for specific individuals or specific species if they are not suited to the environment.
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Man can will nothing unless he has first understood that he must count on no one but himself; that he is alone, abandoned on earth in the midst of his infinite responsibilities, without help, with no other aim than the one he sets himself, with no other destiny than the one he forges for himself on this earth.
~Jean-Paul Sartre
Monkeys in Clothes - hosted by SFN blogs |
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| Ruro |
| Posted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 9:07 pm Post subject: |
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My Head exploded.
Based on what you just said... evolution obviously can't save us from very swift natural disasters. If it's a gradual thing for us to adapt to... we could... still die out, or some of us might live and continue forth... so it's not really evolution killing us, because the evolution you speak of is actually trying to save us. Then in that case... if we do disperse ourselves among planets (lol), we'll be fine... because it's just Natural Disasters we are avoiding. Mars is our backup plan for the Human Race, if the Earth gets in trouble XD
I hope I get that right? 
| Quote: |
| You said "evolution" is something for humans to fear, and then you mentioned natural disasters and genetic flaws. |
They were... meant to be unrelated. Except for the Genetic flaws part, as presumably for Humans to change biologically, Genes to need to change to attempt an adaption to... whatever is going on, Climate Change on the planet or something?
I will go to bed this time, I'm rather tired at this now 5am time, and will re-read what you said when I have a better state of mind tomorrow. And thank you for putting up with me XD |
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| BumFluff |
| Posted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 10:54 pm Post subject: |
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My purpose in life is to be remembered by as many individuals I can after I die. If that means spreading my seed or doing great things so be it. Actually I know of one person who, according to a show I watched, is the descendant of approximately 1/4 of everyone of Chinese descent. Ghenghis (or Chingis) Khan.
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| Ophiolite |
| Posted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 12:43 am Post subject: |
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Forum Radioactive Isotope
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| BumFluff wrote: |
| Actually I know of one person who, according to a show I watched, is the descendant of approximately 1/4 of everyone of Chinese descent. Ghenghis (or Chingis) Khan. |
I thnk you meant ancestor. If you meant descendant, then Ghengis must have mastered time travel and genetic engineering, both.
Smart and deadly.
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The Universe is not only weirder than we imagine it is weirder than we can imagine. J.B.S.Haldane. |
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| Theoryofrelativity |
| Posted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 6:54 am Post subject: |
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Virus's direct our evolution, and thus elimination of virus's prevents our intended evolution.
We are in so many ways defying nature.
Meanwhile if you want to know what it is to live a basic existence just research many of the tribes that still live as they did thousands of years ago. There are plenty to choose from.
They survive, they reproduce (as Ophi said) they tell stories and enjoy their time alive as much as their resources allow. They leave no monument, no great invention, nothing to tell they were here at all except the stories passed from one generation to another and of course now the records we have made of their existence.
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'Time is the space between birth and death' by me. |
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| Pong |
| Posted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 3:28 pm Post subject: Re: Purpose of life lost in evolution? |
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| organic god wrote: |
was walking through london streets today, and was thinking of all the people hurrying to work and all the other things we fill our lives with.
wealth, culture, employment etc.
and i wondered if this was our true purpose in life?
and then i thought of primitive man, where life was simple before all the complications arose and i wondered if we used to live our lives according to the "meaning of life"
i was considering doing some research into this, and maybe finding the real meaning of life. |
Life strives for organisation. We seem to be doing a good job.
Life also has this trick of expanding its conditions by making ever larger containers, which are alive in themselves. It's a product of organisation. London came to life a long time ago. London proceeded to spawn more Londons, naturally.
What are "we"? Are we DNA? Are we an internet? Perhaps we are essentially a finger, pointing; we are matter's hook to another dimension. |
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| Absum! |
| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 2:33 am Post subject: |
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Just two things which causes the most suffering and problems in a human life
Time & Money
Never enough of one or the other, and always having to sacrifice one for the sake of the other.
And you know what the scariest thing is?
They are both illusions! |
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| Dlrow |
| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 3:43 am Post subject: |
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Defination of 'Purpose' : An object to be reached; a target; an aim; a goal; A result that is desired; an intention; The act of intending to do something; resolution; determination; The subject of discourse; the point at issue; The reason for which something is done, or the reason it is done in a particular way.
Clearly the purpose is yet to be discovered. It has not come about for man. We are searching for something which has not happened yet or maybe it never will.
It seems all things in reality are always changing. Growing developing and then being destroyed by the very natures and physical laws it was created and interconnected with.
When individuals reach a point of discovering 'self purpose' - it is a personal thing. This is what should consern us as individuals rather than the purpose of the entire human race as one functioning life.
It is the subjective life, our own life, the only life we can really have a 'purpose' to work towards and forfill.
If we try to answer the question of what is the 'purpose' of mankind. Well thats something we as a race have to decide ourselves as we are the individuals making the moves and the choices. Its our choice - the 'purpose'.
We can work will what we got and make the choice upon what we got. |
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| marine(uc) |
| Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 5:12 am Post subject: |
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too me, all that life is, is a speices trying to advance and live and strive.
all life forms do the exact same thing, breed, eat, drink, and expand.
every single life form has the same goal just to live for the sake of living and keeping your race and genes alive.
its all quite pointless really, we just try and cover it up...
our enjoyment is simply human interactions and social dynamics and artificial stimulation, like video games and movies. and fucking with our heads with drugs like alcahol, weed ect.
every single creature just lives to live nothin else to it.
I'll tell you what your purpose is, go to school, find out what your best at, educate on that subject, get a job, buy a house, find a mate, and have babies to further your genes into the gene pool otherwise your dead to our species.
there now everyone know's their personal purpose to mankind.
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to discover is to create. |
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| Pong |
| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 1:50 am Post subject: |
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| marine(uc) wrote: |
too me, all that life is, is a speices trying to advance and live and strive.
all life forms do the exact same thing, breed, eat, drink, and expand.
every single life form has the same goal just to live for the sake of living and keeping your race and genes alive.
its all quite pointless really, we just try and cover it up...
our enjoyment is simply human interactions and social dynamics and artificial stimulation, like video games and movies. and fucking with our heads with drugs like alcahol, weed ect.
every single creature just lives to live nothin else to it.
I'll tell you what your purpose is, go to school, find out what your best at, educate on that subject, get a job, buy a house, find a mate, and have babies to further your genes into the gene pool otherwise your dead to our species.
there now everyone know's their personal purpose to mankind. |
Here ya go: Little Boxes - Pete Seeger (YouTube) |
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