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| Heliopolis |
 Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 12:36 pm Post subject: Natural Selection and Genetics |
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Forum Junior
Joined: 09 May 2008
Posts: 226
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Its been a while since I mentioned the problem of selection
as applied to genetics. I was corresponding with the leading
expert in pop genetics, Prof Joe Felsenstein, about it.
He has been on vacation but is now going to look at my
simulation of a multilocus model with a mixture of
beneficial and deleterious alleles.
At issue is the very credibility of the modern synthesis
of evolution.
The results so far are terrible for the Neo-Darwinists
and could even have them condemned for almost criminal
negligence.
Anyone familiar with pop genetics is welcome to
request a copy of the simulation by emailing me.
I am convinced that it will mark the beginning of
the end for Neo-Darwinism. |
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| Obviously |
| Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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Forum Professor
Joined: 14 Aug 2007
Posts: 1140
Location: Norway
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| Dictionary wrote: |
Delusion
–noun
1. an act or instance of deluding.
2. the state of being deluded.
3. a false belief or opinion: delusions of grandeur.
4. Psychiatry. a fixed false belief that is resistant to reason or confrontation with actual fact: a paranoid delusion.
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_________________
You can't determine what's good and what's bad before you've seen both extremes. |
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| paralith |
| Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 1:32 pm Post subject: |
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Forum Ph.D.
Joined: 06 Jun 2007
Posts: 1041
Location: Washington, DC
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Wow. You started a whole thread to say, "Hey! Just reminding you, I'm going to be right, and you're all going to be wrong!" We are plenty aware of your ideas and your opinions about them. Since I doubt that you actually have something new to discuss, I hope the mods move this to the trash.
_________________
Man can will nothing unless he has first understood that he must count on no one but himself; that he is alone, abandoned on earth in the midst of his infinite responsibilities, without help, with no other aim than the one he sets himself, with no other destiny than the one he forges for himself on this earth.
~Jean-Paul Sartre
Monkeys in Clothes - hosted by SFN blogs |
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| Heliopolis |
| Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 2:30 pm Post subject: |
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Forum Junior
Joined: 09 May 2008
Posts: 226
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| Obviously wrote: |
| Dictionary wrote: |
Delusion
–noun
1. an act or instance of deluding.
2. the state of being deluded.
3. a false belief or opinion: delusions of grandeur.
4. Psychiatry. a fixed false belief that is resistant to reason or confrontation with actual fact: a paranoid delusion.
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Neither of the above applies.
The math don't lie.
Darwinism is FINISHED. |
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| marnixR |
| Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 3:46 pm Post subject: |
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Forum Cosmic Wizard
Joined: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 2398
Location: Cardiff, Wales
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| Heliopolis wrote: |
| Darwinism is FINISHED. |
oh so true - long live neodarwinism !
_________________
if you find this place too crowded or too confrontational, how about trying Philosophorum,
the amicable forum where small is beautiful and even the trolls are intelligent
biology without evolution is but stamp collecting |
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| Heliopolis |
| Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 4:25 pm Post subject: |
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Forum Junior
Joined: 09 May 2008
Posts: 226
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| marnixR wrote: |
| Heliopolis wrote: |
| Darwinism is FINISHED. |
oh so true - long live neodarwinism ! |
You see this is the problem.
We all share a collective blame in politicizing science.
Still, I am a moderate when talking about Neo-Darwinism
compared to evolutionary biologist Lynn Margulis.
But I also realize that my simulation proves a very salient
point: It sharply exposes "reductionism" for the lie that it
is: it indicates that science should focus on the "holistic"
property of Nature before all else.
Reducing matters by focusing on a gene in isolation to the
rest of the genome ( which is what population genetics
has done all these years) has been a mistake of epic
proportions. |
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| AnOverThinker |
| Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 9:26 pm Post subject: Hm. |
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Forum Freshman
Joined: 07 Jul 2008
Posts: 10
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I'd just hate to have to go back and sort through a whole mess of experiments just to produce several credible sources that say the exact opposite of what you're saying.
But.. if you say the
| Quote: |
| "very credibility of the modern synthesis of evolution" |
is at stake, I'll just have to bite the bullet I suppose. |
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| Obviously |
| Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 9:36 pm Post subject: |
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Forum Professor
Joined: 14 Aug 2007
Posts: 1140
Location: Norway
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| Heliopolis wrote: |
Neither of the above applies.
The math don't lie.
Darwinism is FINISHED. |
Just the answer we expected 
_________________
You can't determine what's good and what's bad before you've seen both extremes. |
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| free radical |
| Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 10:31 pm Post subject: |
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Forum Masters Degree
Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 503
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| So Heliopolis - Did that university chap ever get round to commenting on your simulation? |
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| spuriousmonkey |
| Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 11:32 pm Post subject: |
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Forum Ph.D.
Joined: 12 May 2005
Posts: 717
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math doesn't lie. Unfortunately yours doesn't match reality.
_________________
“A scientific man ought to have no wishes, no affections, - a mere heart of stone.” |
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| Ophiolite |
| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 2:31 am Post subject: |
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Forum Radioactive Isotope
Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 4555
Location: Scotland
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| Heliopolis wrote: |
You see this is the problem.
We all share a collective blame in politicizing science.
Still, I am a moderate when talking about Neo-Darwinism
compared to evolutionary biologist Lynn Margulis.
But I also realize that my simulation proves a very salient
point: It sharply exposes "reductionism" for the lie that it
is: it indicates that science should focus on the "holistic"
property of Nature before all else.
Reducing matters by focusing on a gene in isolation to the
rest of the genome ( which is what population genetics
has done all these years) has been a mistake of epic
proportions. |
It seems you have no wish to be taken seriously. I have suggested to you before that sprinkling your posts with emotional phraseology will turn people off. That is an absolute. That you continue to do so, rather than focusing on the facts, weakens your position even further.
I was amused by your Appeal to Authority attempt. Perhaps you could share with us examples of Margulis's utter rejection of Neo-Darwinism.
_________________
The Universe is not only weirder than we imagine it is weirder than we can imagine. J.B.S.Haldane. |
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| spuriousmonkey |
| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 2:50 am Post subject: |
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Forum Ph.D.
Joined: 12 May 2005
Posts: 717
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Didn't she just didn't like the focus on competition that some people put on Neo-Darwinism. Usually the people who have no deep knowledge of evolution?
She happens to favour the importance of cooperation and symbiosis, which fits perfectly well within the theory of evolution.
As always, she merely represents a reaction to a form of extremism, and as such she is also rather extreme in her emphasis on symbiosis.
In a way the truth doesn't even lie in the middle. Cooperation between species merely extends the available ecological niches. Radiation into a new niche prevents competition between species. That doesn't mean there isn't competition between the individuals.
Moreover, competition doesn't usually imply a direct competition. It is more of a theoretical concept. On the grand scheme of things Ophiolite and I are competing with each other regarding reproductive success. That doesn't mean of course I am planning to look him up and cut off his testicles. Nor does it mean I have to be aware of the competition. The competition part is something that will sort itself out over the passing of generations.
_________________
“A scientific man ought to have no wishes, no affections, - a mere heart of stone.” |
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| spuriousmonkey |
| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 2:57 am Post subject: |
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Forum Ph.D.
Joined: 12 May 2005
Posts: 717
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Anyway. I sincerely suggest to submit your paper ASAP to a peer-reviewed journal. A theory of this great importance shouldn't be withheld from the scientific community. I feel that the publication of your great theory by means of emailing the random crackpot on this forum is just too demeaning for you and your theory; a theory that will shake the foundation of biological sciences.
May I suggest to submit it to Nature?
Or if you want to publish it quickly: Plos One! They have a very fast peer review process which isn't that strict. That just sounds perfect for your purposes! Moreover, it is an Open Access journal which means that the whole world can read it!
Why waste your time here? Get that thing out there and enjoy the glory of being the first to disprove Darwin in a peer-reviewed journal of international prestige!
I know that I wouldn't hesitate for a second.
_________________
“A scientific man ought to have no wishes, no affections, - a mere heart of stone.” |
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| Heliopolis |
| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:42 am Post subject: |
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Forum Junior
Joined: 09 May 2008
Posts: 226
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| free radical wrote: |
| So Heliopolis - Did that university chap ever get round to commenting on your simulation? |
Yes, he gave me his own template code which I converted into
a a multilocus model showing differential viability.
I had previously been using a differential fertility model which
was irritating the likes of spurious monkey.
Anyway, Felsenstein requires that I do a lot of tests before he
will concede that I am right...but he has accepted that, in
principle, I appear to have found the flaw. |
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| Heliopolis |
| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:44 am Post subject: |
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Forum Junior
Joined: 09 May 2008
Posts: 226
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| spuriousmonkey wrote: |
| math doesn't lie. Unfortunately yours doesn't match reality. |
Rather, your prejudice flies in the face of truth.
If you want to criticize my simulation go ahead.
If you can't, would you kindly be a little more "reticent". |
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